Lanz: So according to what you’re saying, everything under
the skin would not be able to be detected? Mr. Gruber, how secure is something like this? Gruber: What we have here is a so-called “passive scanner,”
operating within a range between infrared and microwave radiation, and, our bodies have a certain temperature and give off a certain band of radiation –
that’s infrared radiation – we give it off, and, of course, through our clothing. And what we have here are detectors which establish whether the
radiation comes through [to the detectors] or not. Were I to step inside, the radiation wouldn’t come through this cell phone in
my breast pocket, and you would probably be able to detect that. Lanz: Well, then let’s try it out, and see whether or not it’s actually possible
to recognize objects that are being carried on or close to your body… Lanz: Mr. Gruber, right this way… Gruber: Sure Lanz: Mr. Gruber, your big premier in the ”Great Body Scanner.” Lanz: So we’re assuming now that we’ll be able to recognize a cell phone, and be
able to tell that Mr. Gruber is carrying several other objects on his person. Lanz: What else do you have, Mr. Gruber?
What else should we expect [to see]? Gruber: a swiss-army knife. Lanz: A swiss army knife, okay… Technician: So you can see that the object is shown in contrast to the body. Here [pointing
to the cell phone] you can see the contrast of the object in relation to the body. Lanz: and the object that we see here? the cell phone. Moderator: okay, we’ll disregard the cell phone now… Gruber: (somewhat incomprehensibly): Is this here seen? Technician: If we were doing a full airport scan, then
the person would also be scanned from the side. Lanz: And that’s why we weren’t able to see the swiss army knife
just a second ago? Were you able to recognize it? Lanz: Where do we see it? Could you please show it to us? Technician: Yes Technician: It would normally be on the side of the person’s… But you can see that the object that was blocking the person’s body shows up
right there [pointing to the cell phone] We would see it later on…. Lanz: Can we see anything else here? Technician: I’m interested in this, what he’s carrying on his back… Lanz: It’s the microphone. Okay… So this white area here stands out? Lanz: [Video Cuts Out] So, Mr. Gruber, did you possess anything else? Gruber: Quite a bit, actually… Here, we have a detonator… Here we have thermite… Lanz: What is thermite? Gruber: Thermite is an incredible substance which burns at 4000 Degrees Celsius Lanz: Wait a second, you had all of that in your pockets? Gruber: Yes Lanz: Were you able to see all of that? Technician: Well… Gruber: And here we have a bandange… Lanz: A bandage: Gruber: which is concealing a container which could contain enough explosive material… to — at least — blow a huge hole in a commercial airliner… Lanz: Why weren’t you able to see these objects? Technician: Well, what I’d like to do is… well, let’s
go back and have a look at the image… So… as we said, in the airport scenario… Lanz [to Politician]: I mean, that’s interesting, isn’t it? We’re
talking about a body scanner, and he has these things… Lanz [to Gruber]: Where were you carrying all of those objects? Gruber: Here, in my pockets… oh, and I
had a nice little lighter in there, too… Technician: If I could answer the question… So, as we said at the start, if this was in
an airport scenario, he would have removed his suit jacket… Gruber: No. One object was not in my
jacket… that was down here [referring to his leg]. Technician, continuing: I said before that we would have seen a
side image, that we can see a profile of the body. Look at the jacket he’s wearing, in the pockets,
where he had concealed the objects in. They weren’t directly on his person, and so the
radiation [coming from his body] wasn’t blocked. That, of course, is a part of the process… And in
an airport scenario, he would have had to remove his jacket… *Unfortunately*, we can’t see things inside the mouth,
only objects between the skin and clothing… Lanz: As we’ve just seen, certain objects were not able to
be detected, precisely because we didn’t rotate to the side — which would normally have occurred. Also, we
didn’t remove the jacket, which is also a factor. But nevertheless, there are things — i.e. the detonator he
[Gruber] was carrying in his mouth, as well as… objects in his “lower back area” — you wouldn’t be able
to detect all that, or would you consider that inaccurate? Technician: There are… No system is perfect… There’s always a backdoor If someone conceals an object on the skin, or if someone
were to swallow something; conceal it under folds of skin… or underneath their feet, then we might not catch it… But it’s still a good, general inspection with these devices… Politician: If the logic is correct here: we don’t have 100%
security — I can subscribe to that statement immediately — And for that reason we can simply not deploy the most
modern technology — you could extend that chain of thought… to other security measures. It is always a question of whether or
not there is a measurable gain of security in the real world No one comes to the conclusion that because a
thief could break in through the windows one should leave the front door unlocked because he could get in anyway Lanz: And now we want to wrap up the
indoor section here and leave the warm studio behind… What have you brought along to show us? Gruber: I haven’t brought any explosives along with me… Lanz: Put a jacket on real quick, it’s cold out there! Mr. Gruber doesn’t need a jacket… 🙂 We’ll be right back. Mr. Gruber, you brought along something to show us? Gruber: We explicitly didn’t make any explosives… We have — so to speak — a garden variety explosive: thermite. Thermite is very simple to produce, capable of burning
at temperatures of 4000 Degrees if done properly… In any case, we’ll see temperatures of 3000 Degrees Celsius (~5400 F) Lanz: Where’d you get it? Gruber: From an over the counter pharmacy! Lanz: So you just go into a plain old pharmacy
or a well-stocked hardware store and purchase it? [to Politician]: Mr. Bosbach (CDU), if you’d come
over here please, we’ll watch [the demonstration] together… So what’s going to happen now? To spell it out loud
and clear: what you’re holding in your hands right now… is available right now in any pharmacy? Gruber: with a cost of several *cents.* It’s not that expensive
at all. You just have to mix it right… We’re, of course, not going to get into that here… Temperatures are about to be reached, which are not particularly harmless… And then we’ll ignite it (I brought that lighter with
me)… When we do that, everyone should… observe what this substance is really capable of… I’d recommend that everyone step back a bit… Lanz: Mr. Bosbach, please join me over here. So, materials such as this can be purchased at
every local pharmacy… how is that possible? Bosbach: That’s not what the security measures at the airport are for.
The point is to prevent — as far as technologically and humanly possible — any materials from coming through
the checkpoint which could potentially endanger crew or passengers on board. That’s precisely the reason why we invest
such large sums in researching and improving security; scientists, industry and with funding from the public sector Lanz: So, temperatures around 2-3K degrees Celsius. And
you said before: they can’t be put out? Gruber: Now we’re going to observe it start to burn. Were we to
add water to it, it would spread through the cabin so that the explosion would be even greater… We can see that it’s starting to melt right through the pan.
Were we in a plane, with the right cables being damaged in a 747, for instance, in the front-left portion of the plane — but we don’t need
to discuss that… you could accomplish a lot with that [if you were a terrorist] Politician: I don’t find this very amusing… Lanz: It’s not about amusement. It’s about the question: why
we tell everyone going through security they have to give up their water bottles, but these kinds of materials are freely available? Politician: I’m not sure if we’re well advised by saying, “Look
at how stupid terrorists are. If they just did… what the Professor here were to do, we could bring down a 747.” Lanz: That’s not the issue here. Lanz: I mean, with the manuals and videos that are available on the
internet. You’re much more aware of that fact than I am… Lanz: I mean, with the manuals and videos that are available on the
internet. You’re much more aware of that fact than I am… But even so, it’s frightening to see what you can purchase
in a regular pharmacy and take on board with you… It’s probable that it [thermite] wouldn’t even be confiscated,
but you want to confiscate my water bottle? Politician: Well, that’s why we need to assure that
such substances never make it on board an aircraft. Prof. Gruber doesn’t claim that the normal metal detectors would…
The normal metal detectors can’t detect such materials. Everything concerning the regulation of fluids on board
the aircraft is done by the EU We have a directive, and we’re planning on loosening this
directive in the future. And I’m afraid that after the — thank God — failed attack on Detroit,
that those plans to ease those regulations will face resistance… I personally don’t find the concept very persuasive. You’re right on that point. The limit is 100 ml container, you arrive with a container 1/10 full
that 125 ml and you have to surrender it at security. I’m not convinced myself… Lanz: I think that’s an honest comment we can end on.
This isn’t about downplaying the seriousness of the matter, it’s about showing that you have to give up a water
bottle, but such materials can be easily brought on board without anyone recognizing it